Curse

yesitsrob · Aug 08, 2007, 04:24 AM // 04:24

I'm pretty bored, while failing at falling asleep a few build ideas that would work against him popped into my mind, probably better than what we ran. Though I wouldn't say they are idiotproof at all.. Actually I'm guessing they'd require a reasonable compitent team.

The only thing really better than 1 12 second There's Nothing To Fear - is 3, 4 second ones. That's like a Heal Party every 4 seconds while having constant damage reduction. Obviously, a Paragon could not do that, since they have Leadership, and it's pretty key to running a Paragon, any other class however could use it.

W/P 1 - quite similar to what Racthoh runs on his, you will struggle to out DPS this build but the defense it offers at the same time will be incredible. Where we had 3 paragon, 3 of this type of thing would do a very similar job

"There's Nothing To Fear!"[skill]Standing Slash[/skill][skill]Sun And Moon Slash[/skill][skill]Dragon Slash[/skill][skill]Flail[/skill]"Save Yourselves!"[skill]Resurrection Signet[/skill][skill]Wild Blow[/skill]

Wild Blow would be a very optional skill, and you'd probably only need 2 copies of Save Yourselves! for full coverage. These warriors will kill things very bloody fast and will keep your party alive. Wow way better than silly earth tanks IMO.

Lightning Reflexes on fiends is annoying hence wild blow, probably only need 1 copy of this. Remedy Signet would work in empty slot.

Splinter Weapon Please
[skill]Splinter Weapon[/skill][skill]Consume Soul[/skill][skill]Protective Was Kaolai[/skill][skill]Spirit Rift[/skill][skill]Ancestor's Rage[/skill][skill]Flesh of my Flesh[/skill] Something else.

Awesome means of buffing your warriors since Orders are not an option, unless you want half your skill bar vs Mallyx Disabled.

I think Flesh of my Flesh is the best res to use against him, he will one hit kill things so a fast recharging, fast casting res is rather ideal, none are faster than this... except Glyph Sacced ones, not recommended.

Monk

Monk bars for fighting Mallyx are going to suck hard, the healing line generally blows and with enchants not being an option there is little else to actually run. The bar I ran was pretty awful

[skill]Word of Healing[/skill][skill]Protective Spirit[/skill][skill]Signet of Rejuvenation[/skill][skill]Healing Touch[/skill][skill]Seed of Life[/skill][skill]Infuse Health[/skill][skill]Heal Other[/skill][skill]Glyph of Lesser Energy[/skill]

Prot spirit not working vs him is absoltely killer, I'm sure a _lot_ more people would have beat him if you could use this skill against him.

Mesmer Idea
With the lack of Prot being available and there generally only being slow spells you can use against him, a FC would be rather ideal - if someone knows how to pre prot - FC Weapon of Warding could be really nice. mesmer would also have insta access to Expel Hexes which is pretty handy when fighting the waves, also can do even faster Flesh of my Flesh ressing. Hexes aren't an option nor is their DPS as it sucks hard but they could really fill a utility roll here that monks will likely struggle to do with the gimped bars they'll like have to bring. - FC Gaze of Fury would be nice if you can't find room for consume soul

Rangers

When fighting Mallyx you are going to want someone who can interrupt his bloody annoying Spirit Summons, they have a long cast time and unless your ranger is sleeping they can be stopped indefinitely, and really, you only need to stop 2 of them anyway.

I was quite fond of Infuriating Heat actually. it caused enemies to kill themselves faster on the priests Visions of Regret and also allowed our paragons to build some skills a lot faster too. With the warrior builds I posted above it would do a pretty similar roll. Sun and Moon Slash under IH imo.

And since you probably won't want your build running many, if any enchants or hexes NR can be really handy.

Barrage might work too, I'm pretty sure it would make for a very spammable Save Yourselve's when fighting the waves

Necros

I guess they could BiP, but I also guess people learn to manage their energy as a viable option as well. They'll definitely get a lot from Soul Reaping, so running Resto Rit necros would work very well too. Shelter and Displacement are two skills I really wouldn't have minded having vs Mallyx. Razah was a bit terrible with his energy so Shelter would have been a no no. You really want to be careful with taking down multiple targets at once against the 18 waves so Spiteful is probably not smart, enfeebling blood is fine vs the mobs, not usable vs Mallyx.

Elementalists Well they'll have Ward Melee, for actual good DPS to use against Mallyx they'll probably not have, SF isn't exactly going to work, and he moves so fast most AoE will fail hard. From what I can tell off the top of my head they'd be best suited to non-damage rolls for this quest. They can carry a TNTF :\

Paragons

I think we've pretty much shown the use of Paragons. Angelic Bond, Defensive Anthems, Lyrics/Aria of Zeal, good DPS, they seem pretty suited.

Sins
I can't really think of many things. Critical Agility would be nice when fighting waves - along with Moebius and Death Blossom Spam (although would have to be careful) They'd also build up plenty of adrenaline so that would be an exploitable thing to try. Their damage combos would probably take up a lot of energy though.
_

These are just some random ideas that I think would likely work vs Mallyx. They're not proven, but I don't really see why they'd fail. Hopefully more people will actually try and beat him. I think I've missed Dervishes on my list... I don't think they are as suited to warriors for this, they are largely very reliant on Enchantments which is a nono for Mallyx. But if I was to do him again with people these are some of the things I'd consider running. Maybe they might work.

undeadgun · Aug 08, 2007, 04:44 AM // 04:44

GG guys, very nicely done, and done in a Heroway... anet nerfed heroway in HA, nerf it in PvE too! J/k

, and yea, Master of Mallyx title shoud give to u guys now lol 再见 karlos lol

AlienFromBeyond · Aug 08, 2007, 06:18 AM // 06:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Racthoh

You can see the builds in the screenshots since the three of us have something posted now.

Here are my three toons on the attached.

Sorry, I can't tell builds merely by the skill icons, hence my asking.

LONGA · Aug 08, 2007, 06:44 AM // 06:44

Good thing that A-net trying to balance this out.

One question have anyone tried the old Kanaxai trick on Mallyx.The Spinal Shiver + Cold weapon.Might not be as potent as using it with Kanaxai But should land some interupt on him.Of course that the guy who charge up on Mallyx gonna need IAS stance to maximize the interrupt chance.

blue.rellik · Aug 08, 2007, 07:07 AM // 07:07

Wow, grats Ractoh, rob. My honest opinion is that you pretty much destroyed every DoA whiner and ignorant player in the game. Not only did you do something loads of people were complaining was impossible, you did it with heroes AND with a non-conventional build. Really that's like beating a car in a race.
When I started this game, I had the impression pushed on me that a war-ele-monk team was pretty much the best (with the occasional ranger and necro for utility) but once I saw the power of the shunned classes (particularly paragons and mesmers), I honestly wanted to change the mindsight of those classes sucking. You guys did that probably the best possible way proving that the stock standard build is not the best (you also proved that Warriors and Paragons are great DPS, something 95% of the PvE community laffs at)

For that I salute you, excellent work

Now you can work on a HM build :P

AlienFromBeyond · Aug 08, 2007, 07:19 AM // 07:19

Hopefully, this'll help people with professions outside of the trinity to get groups in GWEN. Even though I am in that trinity, I never understood why people hated on Paragons despite their solid ranged DPS and party-wide buff support. People love Aegis, and Paragon buffs combined make that look like candy.

Snow Bunny · Aug 08, 2007, 07:22 AM // 07:22

Wow....

Excellent work. Congrats you two.

I guess the 18 15+ pages of this thread mean something...lol.

Karlos, Shan; looks like we all have a bit of tinkering to do.

Game on.

blue.rellik · Aug 08, 2007, 07:48 AM // 07:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by AlienFromBeyond

Hopefully, this'll help people with professions outside of the trinity to get groups in GWEN. Even though I am in that trinity, I never understood why people hated on Paragons despite their solid ranged DPS and party-wide buff support. People love Aegis, and Paragon buffs combined make that look like candy.

Old habits die hard

Kashrlyyk · Aug 08, 2007, 08:07 AM // 08:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by yesitsrob

....
About class, I'm not classy, I'm brutally honest. And the fact we killed Mallyx on our 2nd attempt with 5 heroes .. well it says a lot for the GW PVE community who can't beat him. Sorry though, it's just the way I see it, anyone who hangs around on IRC will probably know this.
....

Read what Racthoh said. Funny, how you don´t mention that, but talk down to everyone.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Racthoh

....
One note: The Summoning Shadows problem... he didn't seem to spam it endlessly. I think I saw him use it a few times on the second attempt, but that was it. For the most part he just ran around and occasionally smacked someone when personally I was expecting to run into the forced shadow stepping. I'd advise others to see if they still have that issue.

Sounds like he wasn´t fighting much.

Shanaeri Rynale · Aug 08, 2007, 08:09 AM // 08:09

GJ

The interesting thng is, it looks like the lack of summoning shadows/sleepy Mallyx that seems to have been the key. Lots of people have run a lot more defensive builds, paragons, rits(see the previous pages) etc but summoning shadows beat them every time.

Other builds had the defensive and killing power but no summoning shadows gives teams chance to actually do stuff, which was always the issue before. That he would spam it, then bash people out of range every 5-7 seconds. Even paragon buffs are no use if half the party is being kicked into touch and out of earshot/spirit range(which was pretty much everyone else's experience). On first glance, It reads like the team used very similar tactics to all the others, just that somehow Mallyx was pacified(shock at seeing paragons maybe).

I'm interested to know what they did to stop SS from being used, was this just a fluke?, did they use/know Curtis's glitch? Was Mallyx stealth fxed in the Aug 3rd update?

Edit: Mallyx was supposedly killable before the Sunspear/factions skills, so I would hope a high requirement in them is'nt needed.

Serendipitous timing on Anets part. Now they dont have to re-work or fix anything...

bilateralrope · Aug 08, 2007, 08:37 AM // 08:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shanaeri Rynale

GJ

The interesting thng is, it looks like the lack of summoning shadows/sleepy Mallyx that seems to have been the key. Lots of people have run a lot more defensive builds, paragons, rits(see the previous pages) etc but summoning shadows beat them every time.

Other builds had the defensive and killing power but no summoning shadows gives teams chance to actually do stuff, which was always the issue before. That he would spam it, then bash people out of range every 5-7 seconds. Even paragon buffs are no use if half the party is being kicked into touch and out of earshot/spirit range. On first glance, tt reads like the team used very similar tactics to all the others, just that somehow Mallyx was pacified(shock at seeing paragons maybe).

I'm interested to know what they did to stop SS from being used, was this just a fluke?, did they use/know Curtis's glitch? Was Mallyx stealth fxed in the Aug 3rd update?

Serendipitous timing on Anets part. Now they dont have to re-work or fix anything...

Yes, I'm also worried that this was just a lucky run.

I also wonder if Mallyx can be killed without any of the Kurzick/Luxon skills, or at least with them at a low rank. Because if not we are talking months of grind before players are able to fight Mallyx.

yesitsrob · Aug 08, 2007, 09:40 AM // 09:40

We are like.. Rank 1, Rank 4, Rank 3 in the title tracks, they don't scale that much. I think we were also rank4, 5, 6 LB too. Our TNTF was Rank9, our Seed of Life was rank 10.

He didn't spam Summoning Shadows as seems to be the case with most, why, I don't know. If it's something we did in that fight that makes it not happen, well it surely wasn't anything intentional, if it was something to do with build compositions or whatever, again... not an intetional thing. Really don't know why.

On the Paragon Buffs, our party was largely all over the place from Wild Smashes and what not. I'm pretty sure a lot of people didn't get them, but the thing 1 hit people even with them a lot of the time. We just ressed through the deaths. Trub having FomF was really nice, in my screen you'll see my Razah was 60'd, Jin was 44'd, I took a death at the end. The para buffs were more important when it came to fighting his spawns - which there are only 2 of and they were generally not the toughest of groups, both always had monks, but they weren't big groups.

Shanaeri Rynale · Aug 08, 2007, 10:15 AM // 10:15

Interesting. When we've and others have fought him before Summoning shadows pretty much prevented res's as every 5-7 seconds you'd get interupted with the shadow step, making ressing kinda impossible.

Maybe they did slip in a fix and not tell anyone? Anyone else tried since Aug 3rd update? Do you use any special positioning (bunching etc)?

John Ebridge · Aug 08, 2007, 11:14 AM // 11:14

Maybe fighting close to the stairs (or his original posistion) instead of fighting close to the gate?

yesitsrob · Aug 08, 2007, 11:24 AM // 11:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Ebridge

Maybe fighting close to the stairs (or his original posistion) instead of fighting close to the gate?

Maybe :\ - We pushed right in to kill 2 of his spirits that we wanted down and generally stayed around his pedestal

Shanaeri Rynale · Aug 08, 2007, 11:25 AM // 11:25

Dunno, There are a few possibilities. So trying to ascertain cause and effect..

1. It was a gltiched spawn (i.e lucky)
2. AN fixed him
3. Something they did unknowingly glitched him and stopped the majority of SS
4. All the other people have tried have got the glitched spawn and this was the correct one.
5. They know how to glitch him, but are not telling.. =p

Possibilities 2 and 4 would mean they killed him in a unglitched state, anything else required some kind(unknowingly or otherwise) Glitch to do the job.

It'll be interesting to see others findings as to ascertain if SS is fixed or not

fenix · Aug 08, 2007, 11:36 AM // 11:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shanaeri Rynale

Dunno, There are a few possibilities. So trying to ascertain cause and effect..

1. It was a gltiched spawn (i.e lucky)
2. AN fixed him
3. Something they did unknowingly glitched him and stopped the majority of SS
4. All the other people have tried have got the glitched spawn and this was the correct one.
5. They know how to glitch him, but are not telling.. =p

Possibilities 2 and 4 would mean they killed him in a unglitched state, anything else required some kind(unknowingly or otherwise) Glitch to do the job.

It'll be interesting to see others findings as to ascertain if SS is fixed or not

Or, here's a possibility. Since everyone else is bad at Mallyx, and has never beat him face to face (always glitching behind things, ditto with priest), then maybe doing that causes him to use SS more often. Like how killing both sides of Gravens makes Abbadon use his skill ALL THE TIME. So since Rob and Racthoh and Trub actually killed him properly, he didn't use it as often. Seems to me like someone is grasping at straws to try and find a reason that isn't simply "I'm not as good as those guys".

yesitsrob · Aug 08, 2007, 11:41 AM // 11:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shanaeri Rynale

Dunno, There are a few possibilities. So trying to ascertain cause and effect..

1. It was a gltiched spawn (i.e lucky)
2. AN fixed him
3. Something they did unknowingly glitched him and stopped the majority of SS
4. All the other people have tried have got the glitched spawn and this was the correct one.
5. They know how to glitch him, but are not telling.. =p

Possibilities 2 and 4 would mean they killed him in a unglitched state, anything else required some kind(unknowingly or otherwise) Glitch to do the job.

It'll be interesting to see others findings as to ascertain if SS is fixed or not

ZzZzZzZz.

We've told exactly what we used to beat him, and how we did it, quite specifically, posted screenshots, a video, posted other methods that would probably work... and you still believe we might have resorted to glitching him... a guy who we'd never fought before and wouldn't know how to glitch, I don't even know how to glitch him the old way, actually I don't even know what the old glitch was since I'd never stepped foot in DoA when it was viable.

He didn't spam summoning shadows, why, I don't know... it might have been something we did, maybe how we just pushed in and fought him, and didn't tend to wander too far from him anyway...

Maybe it's just not impossible and no one who has tried it before has really been any good, likely, yes. It's really funny... 2 weeks ago Racthoh pretty much said to me we need to do DoA to defeat Mallyx because apparently it's impossible now. We did DoA with largely grab and go builds which we tweaked slightly and then beat the guy, and with 5 heroes.

Shanaeri Rynale · Aug 08, 2007, 11:50 AM // 11:50

Loads of people have fought him in the middle as above before, bunching up around him etc etc.
For sure up until Jul 20th, people used the easy way to kill hiim and i'm sure that stifled build development some. The old door glitch made Mallyx not cast SS as much so that can't be it.

No I did'nt say resorted to, just that Something was different this time to pacify Mallyx and we're trying to find out what it was. There IS a difference between doubting people(which I don't) and ascertaining what the criteria are for success in a dispassionate manner. The latter is what I am trying to do. To do so requires a few more runs in order to work out exactly happend.

In other words I don't doubt it happened, I just would like to work out how the main threat of Summoning Shadows was negated, as without as Mallyx is pretty easy.. Enjoy the acheivement, and I'm not meaning to take away from it one bit.

E-peen and ego stuff is irrelevant and shows a lack of maturity and self confidence, and I suggest it's left out of this thread.

fenix · Aug 08, 2007, 12:51 PM // 12:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shanaeri Rynale

Loads of people have fought him in the middle as above before, bunching up around him etc etc.
For sure up until Jul 20th, people used the easy way to kill hiim and i'm sure that stifled build development some. The old door glitch made Mallyx not cast SS as much so that can't be it.

No I did'nt say resorted to, just that Something was different this time to pacify Mallyx and we're trying to find out what it was. There IS a difference between doubting people(which I don't) and ascertaining what the criteria are for success in a dispassionate manner. The latter is what I am trying to do. To do so requires a few more runs in order to work out exactly happend.

In other words I don't doubt it happened, I just would like to work out how the main threat of Summoning Shadows was negated, as without as Mallyx is pretty easy.. Enjoy the acheivement, and I'm not meaning to take away from it one bit.

E-peen and ego stuff is irrelevant and shows a lack of maturity and self confidence, and I suggest it's left out of this thread.

You don't seem to be taking this too well. Just because someone achieved (with heroes) what you have not been able to, does not mean that there was something broken with the way they did it. It's simply a case of rob being good, and every one else being bad. It isn't the end of the world because someone is better than you.

And like I posted before, because they didn't run things that can get shut down by Mallyx, and because they were aggressive, and because they didn't try to glitch anything, maybe Mallyx responded the way he is meant to. Rather than glitching when you try to use broken mechanics to win.